Question:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I was waiting for my flight out of MDW last Friday, and found that a >number of flights had been disrupted. The departure board looked like >it frequently does during bad winter weather, with the word "Delayed" >next to perhaps a dozen flights. The only difference was that the >weather was warm, relatively, with blue skies and sunshine. >It turned out that "W" had dropped into Cleveland for a visit, and shut >down operations while AF1 lumbered in and out. The result was delay to >a number of flights due through MDW, by as much as two hours, thirty >minutes. Because of the disruption, not only were flights to and from >Cleveland late, flights going to other destinations on aircraft that had >come through Cleveland were late. >One woman I spoke to was quite distraught, since her flight was delayed >over two hours, and she was going to miss the last shuttle bus for the >day from her destination airport to her home town some miles away. She >was going to have to stay in an airport hotel for the night, and as it >would be Saturday, the shuttle ran on a reduced schedule, and there >wouldn’t be a run until after noon, meaning she essentially lost all of >Saturday with her kids in the bargain. Her last comment to me was that >she wasn’t voting Republican again. >The effect I saw in Chicago must have also been felt at any number of >other airports, since Cleveland is a Continental hub, and many other >airlines, like Southwest, have a strong presence there. >There has to be a less intrusive way of handling AF1. Perhaps it needs >to restrict itself to military fields, where protection is easier, or >maybe the restrictions on other aircraft movements in the area around >AF1 have to be relaxed. The President makes no friends by goofing up >everybody’s plans like this.
We were flying in and out of Minneapolis a couple of years ago when Air Force One was there. It didn’t affect us at all landing. It was leaving about the same time our connection was. We heard one plane called to leave a few minutes early and ours was delayed perhaps 10 minutes. I’m not sure why planes would be delayed a couple of hours for this. Were there any other possible reasons such as bad weather?
Response:
> There has to be a less intrusive way of handling AF1. Perhaps it > needs to restrict itself to military fields, where protection is > easier, or maybe the restrictions on other aircraft movements in the > area around AF1 have to be relaxed. The President makes no friends by > goofing up everybody’s plans like this.
happens when he’s overseas too, and boy that is unpopular as foreigners don’t venerate the office of US president like americans do. they should land him at military fields,and then finish the journey if necessary in a helicopter. I bet there was myriad little tragedies like that of the lady you mentioned, all knock-ons from those delayed flights. ant
Response:
"The President makes no friends by goofing up everybody’s plans like this." Well… THAT is the whole intention, to make sure that the President is hated by his people. The same goes when the President goes overseas, so that he too would be hated by people overseas. Now the question is, are you going to let ‘their’ plan succed (by getting upset and then end up hating the President) or are you going to fail ‘them’ in ‘their’ plan (by not getting upset and actually like the President)?
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->We may now be the financially poorest large city in the USA but at least >most of us don’t suffer from the unsightly conditions that apparently >plagues you; a sorely distended ego compounded by a flatulent mouth… > Actually Miami is the poorest major US city…and Detroit is right down > there too… > It’s so easy to make jokes about Cleveland, but it has been doing somewhat > okay compared to the old daze of 20 – 30 – odd years ago, there has been a > revival of the downtown area, e.g. The Flats, etc….
It would be hard to describe the Flats as a revival. As far as I can remember there never was anything to revive. Development of the Flats I’ll buy. Now the downtown area (upstairs) has undergone a revival after a long decline. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> If you want to see a real sad civic case, visit St. Louis aka "The > necropolis on the Mississippi"…much of it resembles Berlin or Warsaw c. > 1945.
Response:
I love to see AF-1, the 747 take-off and land, and generally, the U.S. Secret Service does prefer military airfields for arrival and departure. Also, many places the President visits don’t really have the 747 runway capacity – ORF for instance, when the Norfolk Navy Base and Oceana NAS are right there. But, there is a difference. When campaigning, Air Force 1 with the President prefers commercial airports with the airport arrival and the large crowds, instead of the limited access military bases, for political purposes. As a rule, each President dictates his own security arrangements with the Service – and when campaigning, he isn’t going to fly into a military base when he can get a huge voter reception at a public airport, usually planned well in advance. When he isn’t campaigning, and now in his second term, no reason for Bush, Jr. to glad hand the public, Air Force 1 can move in and out of military facilities easily. As for disrupting air traffic all around a particular city, the plane can travel with fighter escort all across the world, non-stop. There is no particular safety reason for other commercial airliners to be grounded to get out of its way. It is given a clear airway, but usually it is known in advance when the President is traveling and where, so closing down operations because he is there isn’t really helping him security wise.
Response:
Unfortunately Greg, I believe we now hold this dubious title on some governmental list; the local media has been going nuts on it for over a month now. Funny though how it coincides with Cleveland also being one of the most affordable placed to live in the USA… I do remember those ‘daze’ you refer to, being a Fifty Year resident…East Bank of the flats is dead, ‘warehouse district’ just up the hill is happening; West Bank going gangbusters! BTW…Thanks to the Zebra Mussel invasion Erie is looking as Blue as the Mediterranean of the Rivera…. Nice backdrop for the Cleveland Grand Prix and Air Show too… On those off days attending our world renown Cleveland Orchestra concerts and Cleveland Museum of Art of course… When we’re not working at the world renown Cleveland Clinic/ University Hospital complexes repairing world leaders and assorted Potentates; or educating them at Case Western Reserve University that is… <g> Tim K "Gregory Morrow" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We may now be the financially poorest large city in the USA but at least > most of us don’t suffer from the unsightly conditions that apparently > plagues you; a sorely distended ego compounded by a flatulent mouth… > Actually Miami is the poorest major US city…and Detroit is right down > there too… > It’s so easy to make jokes about Cleveland, but it has been doing somewhat > okay compared to the old daze of 20 – 30 – odd years ago, there has been a > revival of the downtown area, e.g. The Flats, etc…. > If you want to see a real sad civic case, visit St. Louis aka "The > necropolis on the Mississippi"…much of it resembles Berlin or Warsaw c. > 1945. > — > Best
Response:
> We may now be the financially poorest large city in the USA but at least > most of us don’t suffer from the unsightly conditions that apparently > plagues you; a sorely distended ego compounded by a flatulent mouth…
Actually Miami is the poorest major US city…and Detroit is right down there too… It’s so easy to make jokes about Cleveland, but it has been doing somewhat okay compared to the old daze of 20 – 30 – odd years ago, there has been a revival of the downtown area, e.g. The Flats, etc…. If you want to see a real sad civic case, visit St. Louis aka "The necropolis on the Mississippi"…much of it resembles Berlin or Warsaw c. 1945. — Best
Response:
We may now be the financially poorest large city in the USA but at least most of us don’t suffer from the unsightly conditions that apparently plagues you; a sorely distended ego compounded by a flatulent mouth… Tim K
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Cut him some slack. He had to go to Cleveland. I think that is > punishment enough. > At least the Cuyahoga river did not catch fire when he was there. > — > Joseph Meehan > Dia’s Muire duit
Response:
> Since the Iraq invasion, the Bush regime has become very scared
Speaking of scared, why are you afraid to discuss the fact that your country is holding six hostages? Is it because you can only write about three things? Those three things being your hatred of America, your twisted fascination with the foreskins of other men, and your desire to play pretend "airline expert" when you haven’t been on a plane in almost 10 years?
Response:
>> Since the Iraq invasion, the Bush regime has become very scared >Speaking of scared, why are you afraid to discuss the fact that your country >is holding six hostages? Is it because you can only write about three >things? Those three things being your hatred of America, your twisted >fascination with the foreskins of other men, and your desire to play pretend >"airline expert" when you haven’t been on a plane in almost 10 years?
The answer is yes.
Response:
> Well, there was the time that his predecessor spent two extra hours on the > tarmac at LAX getting a haircut (from some chic Hollywoodish salonkeeper). > Apparently, there were loud moans and groans from the myriad delayees.
Did he actually shut down operations at LAX, or just disrupt it byt blocking some taxiway to a runway ? Since the Iraq invasion, the Bush regime has become very scared (rightfully since it is despised around the world) and has increased the demands on airports it travels to with increased levels of shutdown of both ground and airspace around the war criminal’s plane. When bush went to visit the US airbase in germany, he imposed himself on Frankfurt airport, forcing it to shutdown twice (for arrival and departure), as well as forcing the closure fo streets and a highway to get him by car to the US airforce base. The war criminal should have landed at his own air force base. I think Bush underestimates the hatred against him (but secret service doesn’t) and still thinks that people actually appreciate seeing him and his plane, so he decides to land at the most popular airports.
Response:
>I was waiting for my flight out of MDW last Friday, and found that a > number of flights had been disrupted. The departure board looked like > it frequently does during bad winter weather, with the word "Delayed" > next to perhaps a dozen flights. The only difference was that the > weather was warm, relatively, with blue skies and sunshine.
Cut him some slack. He had to go to Cleveland. I think that is punishment enough. At least the Cuyahoga river did not catch fire when he was there. — Joseph Meehan Dia’s Muire duit
Response:
I was waiting for my flight out of MDW last Friday, and found that a number of flights had been disrupted. The departure board looked like it frequently does during bad winter weather, with the word "Delayed" next to perhaps a dozen flights. The only difference was that the weather was warm, relatively, with blue skies and sunshine. It turned out that "W" had dropped into Cleveland for a visit, and shut down operations while AF1 lumbered in and out. The result was delay to a number of flights due through MDW, by as much as two hours, thirty minutes. Because of the disruption, not only were flights to and from Cleveland late, flights going to other destinations on aircraft that had come through Cleveland were late. One woman I spoke to was quite distraught, since her flight was delayed over two hours, and she was going to miss the last shuttle bus for the day from her destination airport to her home town some miles away. She was going to have to stay in an airport hotel for the night, and as it would be Saturday, the shuttle ran on a reduced schedule, and there wouldn’t be a run until after noon, meaning she essentially lost all of Saturday with her kids in the bargain. Her last comment to me was that she wasn’t voting Republican again. The effect I saw in Chicago must have also been felt at any number of other airports, since Cleveland is a Continental hub, and many other airlines, like Southwest, have a strong presence there. There has to be a less intrusive way of handling AF1. Perhaps it needs to restrict itself to military fields, where protection is easier, or maybe the restrictions on other aircraft movements in the area around AF1 have to be relaxed. The President makes no friends by goofing up everybody’s plans like this.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I was waiting for my flight out of MDW last Friday, and found that a > number of flights had been disrupted. The departure board looked like > it frequently does during bad winter weather, with the word "Delayed" > next to perhaps a dozen flights. The only difference was that the > weather was warm, relatively, with blue skies and sunshine. > It turned out that "W" had dropped into Cleveland for a visit, and shut > down operations while AF1 lumbered in and out. The result was delay to > a number of flights due through MDW, by as much as two hours, thirty > minutes. Because of the disruption, not only were flights to and from > Cleveland late, flights going to other destinations on aircraft that had > come through Cleveland were late. > One woman I spoke to was quite distraught, since her flight was delayed > over two hours, and she was going to miss the last shuttle bus for the > day from her destination airport to her home town some miles away. She > was going to have to stay in an airport hotel for the night, and as it > would be Saturday, the shuttle ran on a reduced schedule, and there > wouldn’t be a run until after noon, meaning she essentially lost all of > Saturday with her kids in the bargain. Her last comment to me was that > she wasn’t voting Republican again. > The effect I saw in Chicago must have also been felt at any number of > other airports, since Cleveland is a Continental hub, and many other > airlines, like Southwest, have a strong presence there. > There has to be a less intrusive way of handling AF1. Perhaps it needs > to restrict itself to military fields, where protection is easier, or > maybe the restrictions on other aircraft movements in the area around > AF1 have to be relaxed. The President makes no friends by goofing up > everybody’s plans like this.
Well, there was the time that his predecessor spent two extra hours on the tarmac at LAX getting a haircut (from some chic Hollywoodish salonkeeper). Apparently, there were loud moans and groans from the myriad delayees. Here, where he comes and goes regularly, AF1 (when its the 747) uses the Texas State Techinical College Airport, a former USAF base with 10,000′ runway across town), unable to operate comfortably from the 6600′ or so short runway at ACT, only a few miles from the ranch at Crawford (although there ain’t exactly a stream of flights coming and going from ACT). Restrictions on local airspece when he’s here cause more complaints, although the sound of Marine 1’s turbines passing about a quarter mile from my bedroom window can rouse you when he’s up for an early morning sortie. I suspect that the Cleveland problem resulted from the lack of a suitable nearby military facility (which the SecServ likes from security perspectives). TMO
Response: